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North versus South - Page 2

View Poll Results: How should we refer to the geographical sections of New Jersey?

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  • North Jersey & South Jersey

    6 50.00%
  • northern New Jersey & southern New Jersey

    6 50.00%
  • suburb of Philadelphia & suburb of New York

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Thread: North versus South

  1. #21
    Tourist general_lee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JerseyDevil
    who are you talking to here?
    that's rather obvious

    Quote Originally Posted by JerseyDevil
    My sole problem with the dredging is how much does it support NJ, versus Phildelphia. That's the question you should be asking. The dredging in northern New Jersey you mention SOLELY supports New Jersey, not New York.
    ??? Ok...they have better drugs in North Jersey

    Quote Originally Posted by JerseyDevil
    The dreding in NY harbor supports Port Newark/Elizabeth. What will the dredging of the Delaware support - from what I have seen - the majority supports Pennsylvania and very little for New Jersey.
    Have you even heard of the South Jersey Port Corporation?

  2. #22
    New Jersey Ambassador Admin & Founder JerseyDevil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by general_lee
    that's rather obvious
    well it's actually not - because you came right out into attack mode as your first post. So I guess you just hate northern New Jersey. But then again - I bet you have hardly spent any time in the northern part of the state - which is often a problem.
    ??? Ok...they have better drugs in North Jersey
    You are right about that - northern New Jersey is the pharmeceutical capital of the world, with Bristol-Meyers Squibb, Merck, and many others located there. I would like to know what the hell that has to do with my comment - "My sole problem with the dredging is how much does it support NJ, versus Phildelphia. That's the question you should be asking. The dredging in northern New Jersey you mention SOLELY supports New Jersey, not New York." I guess you were just trying to divert attention from the truth and trying to make some snide comment about drugs being transported through the port. If that is the case - then I guess you support the dredging in Philadelphia - yes PHIL-A-DEL-PHIA - so people in southern New Jersey have easier access to illegal drugs.
    Have you even heard of the South Jersey Port Corporation?
    Yes I have - that doesn't mean that the dredging operation doesn't benefit PHILDELPHIA more though. It's so PHILADELPHIA can expand it's ports - that's why Pennsylvania politicians keep speaking out about it and why THEY are the ones trying to stirup the "north/south" argument in New Jersey. PHILADELPHIA wants to compete with NEW JERSEY'S port in Elizabeth/Newark. If New Jersey politicians said that they wanted the dredging so they could expand and compete with Philadelphia - then I would be for it, but so far I haven't heard much of that.

    BTW - I noticed you ignored most of my other comments. Also, I like your avatar

    - but I should tell you that that goes for Philadelpians also, not just New Yorkers. Also, the only way you can claim superiority is if you are actually born in New Jersey, but we are all immigrants anyway. I was born in New Jersey and I grew up in New Jersey (as well as my mother and father and grandparents). However, it seems to me that unlike you - I claim ALL of NEW Jersey as my home, while you want to split the state apart and only consider yourself a southern New Jerseyan. I welcome anyone to live in NJ - just as long as they respect the state. You seem not to respect the state - but only a a part of it's overall greatness. I have seen many NATIVE New Jerseyans litter, and dis New Jersey (such as yourself). I have also heard many New Yorkers (although it is rare) praise the beauty of New Jersey. I see no need to single out New Yorkers on your avatar.

    I'm telling you - if you want New Jersey to be the great state it can be, then you better start speaking out against our politicians cowtowing to New York AND Pennsylvania. Whether a business is located in northern New Jersey, or southern New Jersey - all that state reaps the benefits. When a business is located in NY or Pennsylvania - NJ doesn't reap any benefits, except makes NJ into a commuter state and brings more people in who don't really care about the state.
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  3. #23
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    Good post J.D. but on thing I completly disagree with you is when you said we are all imigrants . I was born here in N.J. meaning I came from the U.S. ,I did not migrate from another country meaning I am not an imigrant ! On another note I also consider all of N.J. my home . We as a state must look out for ourselves not n.y. or pa. I believe port Elizabeth is the largest port in the country and 80% of what this COUNTRY uses comes through that port . As far as you Private Lee you better watch yourself my wife is from N.Y. If YOU are so unhappy in N.J. LEAVE and go to your garden of eden in Pa. Just act you age and dont be offending people you dont know. Our state takes enough crap from the outside and we dont need it from the inside . Show some N.J. pride and take your head out of Pennsylvanias ASS ! Oh and one last note if I want to go down the shore that is what I will do regardless of what you say or your websites! Lee should have been executed after the war . Remember he lost the war meaning he went down in history as a LOSER . 88,000 N.J. troops helped kick his ASS in the long run if you are such a proud New Jerseyian why do you want to be named after him?
    Last edited by NJPRIDE; 07-25-2006 at 05:50 PM.
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  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by NJPRIDE
    Good post J.D. but on thing I completly disagree with you is when you said we are all imigrants . I was born here in N.J. meaning I came from the U.S. ,I did not migrate from another country meaning I am not an imigrant !
    I had posted that because I didn't want him to claim that his family goes all the way back to he original colonial settlers - while mine only go back to Ellis Island and therefore he is more of a New Jerseyan than I am. In that respect we are all immigrants. Our ancestors had to come from somewhere (unless you are Lenape Indian - although even they migrated to NJ), before settling in NJ.
    New Jersey is the only state honored by two resorts at Walt Disney World. The Beach Club Resort, modeled after Historic Cape May and The Boardwalk Resort, after Atlantic City. If the Jersey Shore is good enough for Walt Disney to recreate, isn't the REAL Jersey Shore even better for you and your family?

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  5. #25
    New Jersey Tour Guide Jersey Warren's Avatar
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    Default A state of immigrants

    Years ago, John F. Kennedy wrote a book called "A Nation of Immigrants." Being that Ellis Island is entirely surrounded by New Jersey waters, and a good part of the island itself is in New Jersey, I think it's appropriate to call New Jersey "A state of immigrants."

    One of the things I always liked about my home state is its great diversity of people. All Americans, all New Jerseyans, but with such a variety of cultures!



    Quote Originally Posted by JerseyDevil
    I had posted that because I didn't want him to claim that his family goes all the way back to he original colonial settlers - while mine only go back to Ellis Island and therefore he is more of a New Jerseyan than I am. In that respect we are all immigrants. Our ancestors had to come from somewhere (unless you are Lenape Indian - although even they migrated to NJ), before settling in NJ.

  6. #26
    New Jersey Ambassador Admin & Founder JerseyDevil's Avatar
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    I was just watching NJN News and they repeatedly said "North Jersey" and "South Jersey". This is really starting to grate on my nerves so I sent the following e-mail to them....

    In my analysis of New Jersey, the use of the terms North and South Jersey is one the aspects which continue to encourage infighting in the state (the north versus south divide). We are ALL New Jerseyans and the use of North Jersey and South Jersey is grammatically incorrect and perpetuates this division.

    The correct usage is southern New Jersey and northern New Jersey - with the "n" and "s" lower case. We are NOT two seperate states - we are one state.

    I hope in the future that NJN will promote the healing of New Jersey and use the terms southern and northern New Jersey in the future. Southern New Jersey and northern New Jersey properly describes a geographical location, not a political/territorial division like South Jersey and North Jersey does.

    Thank you -

    Robert Rosetta, President
    AboutNewJersey.com
    New Jersey is the only state honored by two resorts at Walt Disney World. The Beach Club Resort, modeled after Historic Cape May and The Boardwalk Resort, after Atlantic City. If the Jersey Shore is good enough for Walt Disney to recreate, isn't the REAL Jersey Shore even better for you and your family?

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  7. #27
    New Jersey Ambassador Admin & Founder JerseyDevil's Avatar
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    There seems to be a documentary being made asking where is the dividing line between North and South Jersey. There is NO North or South Jersey - that's why they have to ask the question.

    I tried posting the following on the NJ.com blog on it - but I'm not sure if it's going through or if it waits for moderation.

    We are ONE state - not two. I hate the term "South Jersey" and "North Jersey". It should properly be southern NEW Jersey and northern New Jersey. We have a discuss of this at the [url=http://www.AboutNewJersey.com]AboutNewJersey.com/url] messageboard - <a North Versus South

    One of New Jersey's problems is that we are constantly fighting against ourselves instead of acting like a state with a common goal. Southern New Jersey is NOT part of Philadelphia and northern New Jersey is NOT part of New York. We are New JERSEYANS and we better start acting like it - fighting for our interests that support New Jersey instead of always willing to support the wishes of our regional neighbors on the opposing rivers.

    You can see some of the attitude of south versus north here - but yet we're willing to spend billions of dollars for a second rail tunnel to export our jobs to New York. If people want the financial situation to get better in New Jersey - then you better start working FOR New Jersey as a whole, instead of this regional nonsense.
    You can read their blog at - Where does North Jersey end and South Jersey begin?

    I don't know why I'm giving you the link - they don't allow for links. I hate that when messageboards and blogs do that - it used to be that the web was all about sharing information and linking. Now it's all about making sure that people don't leave your site or know what else is out there.
    New Jersey is the only state honored by two resorts at Walt Disney World. The Beach Club Resort, modeled after Historic Cape May and The Boardwalk Resort, after Atlantic City. If the Jersey Shore is good enough for Walt Disney to recreate, isn't the REAL Jersey Shore even better for you and your family?

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  8. #28
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    Smile North Versus South

    Hello. I just registered to this board and saw your posting about North versus South Jersey. I am a born and raised South Jersey girl. Everytime someone asks me where I am from I tell them South Jersey. Why you may ask? Well we consider North Jersey/New York. And South Jersey/Philadelphia. You also asked why South Jersey people would be fans of the Flyers, a team that you say does not bring money into the state of New Jersey. Well one reason is because that is who we were raised to cheer for. Just like most North and Central Jerseyans were raised to cheer for the Devils. And to answer your question, the Flyers do bring money into the state of NJ. Their practice facility is located in Voorhees. And most, if not all the players live in South Jersey. So they pay NJ taxes.

    Many years ago there was a debate as to whether South Jersey should leave NJ altogether and make is own state. Down here in South Jersey we were all for it. However, the people of North Jersey were not, because if we did secede from NJ, then North Jersey would not get any of the revenue money generated from the casinos. So we had to stay.

    One last thing. The counties located in South Jersey are Atlantic, Burlington, Camden, Cape May, Cumberland, Gloucester and Salem. We consider Ocean County to be Central Jersey and everything thing outside of Mercer, Monmouth and Middlesex Counties to be North Jersey.

  9. #29
    New Jersey Ambassador Admin & Founder JerseyDevil's Avatar
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    Kristin -

    Welcome - I hope you will continue to post about all the great things to do in southern New Jersey. My questions were mostly rhetorical. One of the problems that causes New Jersey so many financial problems is that so many New Jerseyans view New Jersey as two different states and fort he most part even think of our state as mere extensions of Philadelphia and New York. I consider myself a New JERSEYAN - northern, central and southern. As you may notice, this site truly does cover all of New Jersey and although it is impossible to split things completely 50/50 since northern New Jersey is more populous, I think we do a very good job of it.

    If New Jersey was to split - it wouldn't be too long before neither section was a state - we would just be annexed by New York State and Pennsylvania.

    As for the Flyers contributing to New Jersey - they do nothing for identifying with the state. Just like I refuse to root for the Giants, Jets or Red Bulls - who are New Jersey teams - but have turned their back on New Jersey and claim to be NY teams - I refuse to root for the Flyers who are a foreign team. The Devils are a TRUE New Jersey team - practicing, playing, living and CALLING themselves - New JERSEY.

    It's time that New Jerseyans put aside their "north versus south" attitude and work together to support New Jersey. As I tell people from both "sides" - cross the 195 divide already! Our Travel Writer lives in Camden County - she went to Jersey City and Newark for the first time last year and is completely unfamiliar with anything north of 195. She was amazed by northern New Jersey. Don't worry though - I equally try to get people who live in northern New Jersey is go south and explore beyond Cape May and Atlantic City.

    Unless we put New Jersey first - we might as well sell the state to Pennsylvania and New York state and call it quits. I however will fight that - because I have NO DESIRE to be a citizen of either state. I'm a New Jerseyan and proud of it.
    New Jersey is the only state honored by two resorts at Walt Disney World. The Beach Club Resort, modeled after Historic Cape May and The Boardwalk Resort, after Atlantic City. If the Jersey Shore is good enough for Walt Disney to recreate, isn't the REAL Jersey Shore even better for you and your family?

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  10. #30
    New Jersey Tour Guide Jersey Warren's Avatar
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    Smile Welcome Kristin!

    I now live in Southwest Florida, so other states identify areas of the state by directions of the compass, as well. I have no problem with using the terms North Jersey and South Jersey as verbal shorthand for the northern and southern portions of the state, but I love all of New Jersey, North, South, Central, East or West. My dividing line as to what constitutes Southern New Jersey, however, has always been where the Shore starts, anything south of Sandy Hook. I know this is far north of the center of the state, but as soon as you cross that Raritan River bridge there is an entirely different feel to things. You go from a world of button-down people focused on status and material things to people who are more casual and as much interested in a leisure lifestyle as keeping up with the Joneses. I saw the change when my family moved from Upper Saddle River to Toms River. My Dad soon retired most of his suits and dress shirts and ties to the back of his closet and actually bought a boat and went fishing and crabbing in Barnegat Bay once in awhile. It's more about lifestyle and attitude than geography. Away, I hope you enjoy this board. There are lots of good people here, some still in New Jersey and some "in exile."

  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jersey Warren View Post
    ...and some "in exile."
    Exile is the optimum word there. I at one point was an exile also. It's also funny how many people I know who thought the grass was greener in other states, such as North Carolina or Florida and ended up moving back.

    It was a bit off topic - so I will again say this - New Jerseyans need to start working together. Enough with this division already. As Ben Franklin said - "We must hang together, gentlemen...else, we shall most assuredly hang separately." Right now we are hanging separately. As Philadelphia and new York expand with a business boom, our cities - both north AND south, suffer. Just look at the contrast between Camden and Philadelphia - Center City and all those skyscrapers in Philadelphia didn't even exist 20 years ago. That could have been Camden if New Jerseyans stopped arguing amongst ourselves and worked together. While we fight amongst ourselves, the cities on the other side of our rivers grow and expand and is fueled by the money of New Jerseyans.
    New Jersey is the only state honored by two resorts at Walt Disney World. The Beach Club Resort, modeled after Historic Cape May and The Boardwalk Resort, after Atlantic City. If the Jersey Shore is good enough for Walt Disney to recreate, isn't the REAL Jersey Shore even better for you and your family?

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  12. #32
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    Default North vs south

    I know this might sound bad, but no matter what anyone thinks, it will also be North Jersey vs South Jersey. We don't like the north and they don't like us. That is all there is to it. I went to college in Morristown and I hated being up there. All of the people seemed so rude to me. I am a Jersey girl and I am proud of it, but if I had to add something to that I am more proud to be a South Jersey Girl.

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by kristin1788 View Post
    I know this might sound bad, but no matter what anyone thinks, it will also be North Jersey vs South Jersey.
    It's actually sad more than anything because New Jersey is weakened by this attitude. We fight amongst ourselves while our neighbors take advantage of it - not to mention our politicians. As long as people have this attitude - i agree it will never change. I hope it does though. It is part of our history though, from colonial times when New Jersey was East and West Jersey to the Civil War when southern New Jersey supported the Confederate States and northern New Jersey supported the Union. There was a huge battle on where New Jersey was going to stand during the Civil War.
    We don't like the north and they don't like us. That is all there is to it. I went to college in Morristown and I hated being up there. All of the people seemed so rude to me.
    I think it's more a factor of preconceived notions than anything else. Often times people look for what they expect, not actually what they see. I have been all over the state and there are nice people in the southern area and there are nice people in the northern area and there are rude and obnoxious people in both areas as well.
    I am a Jersey girl and I am proud of it, but if I had to add something to that I am more proud to be a South Jersey Girl.
    And I say I'm a New Jerseyan first and an American second.

    I don't care about New York and I don't care about Philadelphia - I care about Camden, Trenton, Newark, Jersey City, Bridgeton, etc. Instead of New Jerseyans always looking across our rivers, we should look inward and concentrate on making New Jersey a better place. But to do that both northern and southern New Jersey have to stop their petty bickering.
    New Jersey is the only state honored by two resorts at Walt Disney World. The Beach Club Resort, modeled after Historic Cape May and The Boardwalk Resort, after Atlantic City. If the Jersey Shore is good enough for Walt Disney to recreate, isn't the REAL Jersey Shore even better for you and your family?

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  14. #34
    New Jersey Tour Guide Jersey Warren's Avatar
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    Smile I don't believe a North-South animosity exists

    Quote Originally Posted by kristin1788 View Post
    I know this might sound bad, but no matter what anyone thinks, it will also be North Jersey vs South Jersey. We don't like the north and they don't like us.
    Although I haven't lived in New Jersey for many years, I was born and raised there. My family has a long history in the Garden State. In fact, my grandfather was born in Jersey City exactly 105 years ago today. I still have three brothers there.

    I've visited all of New Jersey from High Point to Cape May and from Alpine to Delaware Bay. I have never witnessed any so-called rivalry or dislike of one group of New Jerseyans for another. (Now we in Northeastern New Jersey disliked New Yorkers, especially when they drove under the speed limit in the left lane, but that's an entirely different story!)

    How about the thousands of people who own one home in northern New Jersey and a second beach home in southern New Jersey. Do they develop a split personality and hate the other half of themselves every time they go away to their other home?

    I grew up just off GSP exit 172, the last exit in New Jersey before crossing into New York state. In spite of that, I felt perfectly at home at the opposite end of the Parkway in Cape May. In many ways, I always liked the southern part of the state more than the northern, but I like all areas of New Jersey (except maybe right next to one of those stereotypical chemical plants or oil refineries!) and have never felt any sort of prejudice on the part of people from one area against another.

  15. #35
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    This is an interesting thread. I'm sorry I only now just discovered it.

    My two cents:

    I was raised in northern New Jersey -- Bergen/Passaic counties -- since I was a 1-year-old and went to preschool, elementary school, high school, and college here. I got married here, bought a house here, had a kid here, and still live here. And I love it.

    I have never considered the terms North Jersey, South Jersey or Central Jersey a negative thing, but I can understand why some might think that. They could be seen as kind of divisive

    I have never had a problem with people from South Jersey (southern New Jersey). My grandfather moved from Brooklyn to Vineland and lived there for many years before passing away. My aunt/uncle/cousins, originally from Brooklyn, have lived in Mount Holly for close to 25 years. Another aunt/uncle/cousin, originally from New York, moved to Eastampton and got involved in local politics. And yet another aunt/uncle/cousins combo moved from New York City to Browns Mills. All are very happy where they are.

    I have spent many summer days down the shore, whether it be Sandy Hook, Sea Bright, Long Branch, Asbury Park, Belmar, Point Pleasant, Seaside Heights, Avalon, Atlantic City, the Wildwoods, or Cape May. I have always respected those areas. While there, I say hello to everyone as I pass them on the street or in the supermarket; I pick up after myself; I don't wear socks and sandals together; I respect the local customs; etc. All of my friends are the same way.

    That being said, I realize there are some misconceptions and animosities between northern and southern New Jersey that have lingered for who knows how long. Same as there are between the North and the South in the country.

    That's unfortunate, I guess.

    All I can do is speak for myself. I'm Jersey and proud of it!
    Last edited by A-Line; 04-17-2009 at 07:03 PM.

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    I agree with you A line in respects that there is no negative animosity with North, South or Central Jersey. That is how it has always been for me. If you ask anyone from my area they will tell you that they are from South Jersey, not New Jersey.

  17. #37
    New Jersey Ambassador Admin & Founder JerseyDevil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kristin1788 View Post
    I agree with you A line in respects that there is no negative animosity with North, South or Central Jersey. That is how it has always been for me. If you ask anyone from my area they will tell you that they are from South Jersey, not New Jersey.
    So then why do people in southern New Jersey feel that they don't want to be considered New Jerseyans or from New Jersey?

    In actuality though - many times - people in northern New Jerseyans feel they are from New York and southern New Jerseyans feel they are from Philadelphia. Neither city which is part of this state and contributes to our economy - but we continue to export everything to them.

    As I said, instead of working together - we work to divide ourselves and fight - while our neighbors get stronger and we get more into a budget mess in Trenton and our politicians use this division.

    Maybe we really should just sell the state. I have mentioned it before - although I would be completely against it - but maybe we should sell southern New Jersey to Pennsylvania and northern New Jersey to New York.
    The obituary
    RIP New Jersey - you were a great state, but due to the infighting between towns, and regions, you cannibalized yourself. You were a keystone in American History, from colonial times to the Crossroads of the American Revolution, to the invention of so many of today's modern conveniences. However, because you were never able to work together, you slowly died and now are a distant memory.
    I have no desire to be part of New York or Pennsylvania. I am a proud New Jerseyan. I don't want to live in Toms River NY or Toms River PA. I also don't want to see this state split in two. We are a small state and it stupid that we have this division - where people in southern New Jersey would rather support a foreign team such as the Flyers, but refuse to support the local team because they are located in northern New Jersey. It's stupid that northern New Jerseyans can't get over themselves and travel southward and see the beautiful countryside of southern New Jersey.

    It's funny, because I lived in so many places - much larger states in terms of geographic areas, Indiana, Illinois, Oregon and they didn't have this division. California has a division, but they are a much much larger state.

    I can't say I don't understand the division in New Jersey - it's in our history from when we were divided into East and West Jersey. It is time we get over this. It is time we stop thinking of ourselves as two different states. Our colonial history has really put us into a weakened state, that we are still dealing with. New York kidnapping two of our colonial governors, blockading our ports, etc. We have had a really hard time developing an identity outside fo NY and Philadelphia metro area, yet little Rhode Island and Connecticut haven't suffered the fate New Jersey has.

    Anyway - this whole thing frustrates me. New Jerseyans don't work for what is best for the state as a whole - instead we are two busy protecting our fiefdoms - whether it's the school districts, small towns, regions - we refuse to work together. New Jersey is merely a collection of fiefdoms, and it's time for it to stop.
    New Jersey is the only state honored by two resorts at Walt Disney World. The Beach Club Resort, modeled after Historic Cape May and The Boardwalk Resort, after Atlantic City. If the Jersey Shore is good enough for Walt Disney to recreate, isn't the REAL Jersey Shore even better for you and your family?

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